Wikidata talk:WikiProject Events and Role Frames

Thanks!

I absolutely love this initiative. I too have noticed these semantic gaps and I would very much like them to be filled in a way that we can agree on as a community. Thanks for beginning this work! So9q (talk) 07:23, 1 December 2023 (UTC)

selectional preference item

I have created an item for selectional preferences and have linked it to some existing papers on Wikidata and creates some instances of it to experiment with selectional preference (Q124051768) عُثمان (talk) 21:32, 30 December 2023 (UTC)

selectional preference

The problem with this idea is that items will be more dependent on other items. The Q_eater is a 'concept of something that can play the role of the agent in the event of eating.'. Only in that understanding can we attach the `selectional preference` to the Q_eater. On the other hand, if we reuse Q1851760 in the `event role` of Q3882219, does it make sense to use `selectional preference`? Arademaker (talk) 14:24, 28 February 2024 (UTC)

@Arademaker I am inclined to say a selectional preference property like the one proposed would be redundant to the event role property itself. If we take the role of "thing eaten," in many languages the word for "food" is a verbal derivative of some kind (cf. Punjabi کھاݨا verbal participle "to eat" = "food" when used as a nominal, Hausa abinici = abin "thing of" + ci "eating" = "thing of eating" = "food"). An eater and an organism that can eat is also the same thing.

Selectional preferences seem like a property of the predicate itself, and in a case like frying waina in oil (Q124822584) which can be expected to be the action denoted by a single verb in various Nigerian languages, an event role for waina (Q65446427) should be enough to state that this is the only type of thing which can be fried in this action. Having a selectional preference on the waina item would look like just duplicating that item.

For assassination, the item assassination victim (Q89060822) does already exist (as well as the word "assassinée" in French and occasionally in English). عُثمان (talk) 20:15, 17 March 2024 (UTC)

Example requiring more complex considerations

A sense of the Burushaski verb یار is putting out to pasture (Q125055839), an event which is likely to be represented by a common simple verb in a number of languages for which animal husbandry is part of everyday life for speakers.

One of the roles in this event is a post-weaning draft animal. The predicate is selecting for this in a way, but in most instances it is the source of information about the life stage of the animal. A subclass of post-weaning animal (Q125056786) for post-weaning draft animals could be made, but such an item does not seem useful to indicate that a cow or sheep of unspecified age should be usable with this predicate while a word for suckling pig (Q23015) is necessarily excluded. More useful might be to have statements on the event allowing any draft animal which is also not a subclass of suckling animals (Q2379143). عُثمان (talk) 01:39, 22 March 2024 (UTC)

why not use properties

Why not use specific properties instead of role classes? In general, how would this proposal be used to help set up notable items that are events? Peter F. Patel-Schneider (talk) 13:17, 19 April 2024 (UTC)