Wikidata:Property proposal/Representative in legislature

representative in legislature

Originally proposed at Wikidata:Property proposal/Organization

   Not done

Description	person who represents the constituency in the legislative body
Represents	member of parliament (Q486839)
Data type	Item
Domain	electoral districts, administrative units
Example 1	Electoral district #213 (Q63087844) → Boryslav Bereza (Q18346435) [ legislative body (P194) = Verkhovna Rada (Q176296) ]
Example 2	Islington North (Q1077552) → Jeremy Corbyn (Q291169) [ legislative body (P194) = House of Commons (Q11005) ]
Example 3	New York (Q1384) → Kirsten Gillibrand (Q22222) and Chuck Schumer (Q380900) [ legislative body (P194) = United States Senate (Q66096) ]
Example 4	Sixth constituency for French residents overseas (Q1103423) → Joachim Son-Forget (Q30343074) [legislative body (P194) → National Assembly (Q193582)]
Planned use	To put this property into all items about Ukrainian electoral districts, one statement per each convocation.
Robot and gadget jobs	I will do the work myself
See also	electoral district (P768) (inverse property)

Motivation

Valuable information about electoral districts, which can not be added using any other existing property. --Tohaomg (talk) 19:10, 22 June 2019 (UTC)

Discussion

•  Support David (talk) 06:16, 23 June 2019 (UTC)
•  Support -Jinoytommanjaly (talk) 08:38, 23 June 2019 (UTC)
•  Oppose. Use electoral district (P768) as a qualifier to position held (P39). --Yair rand (talk) 06:54, 25 June 2019 (UTC)

  Yair rand: huh? The property wouldn't be for persons, but for electoral districts (if I'm not mistaken)... Nomen ad hoc (talk) 10:55, 25 June 2019 (UTC).

  @Nomen ad hoc: I'm presuming the point here is that the same information can be (and usually already is) expressed on the item for the person (e.g. at Q18346435#P39, so doesn't need an inverse on the constituency item. --Oravrattas (talk) 11:33, 25 June 2019 (UTC)

  OK Oravrattas. But IMHO it's somewhat like chairperson (P488), general secretary (P3975) and so on, who also allow to duplicate a such kind of datas... And I guess that a such property would be useful in some WP templates (Q62838042 for instance). Nomen ad hoc (talk) 12:13, 25 June 2019 (UTC).

WikiProject every politician has more than 50 participants and couldn't be pinged. Please post on the WikiProject's talk page instead. ChristianKl ❪✉❫ 09:25, 25 June 2019 (UTC)

•  Comment Tohaomg: interesting. But isn't it similar to represented by (P1875)? Nomen ad hoc (talk) 09:56, 25 June 2019 (UTC).

   Comment I think that widening scope of represented by (P1875) will be better.--Jklamo (talk) 10:01, 25 June 2019 (UTC)

  OK. Hence  Support. Nomen ad hoc (talk) 10:52, 25 June 2019 (UTC).

  Nomen ad hoc represented by (P1875) has a constraint that it is to be used in items about humans, and according to usage list it is indeed used almost exclusively in items about humans. --Tohaomg (talk) 13:05, 25 June 2019 (UTC)

   Comment Indeed; you're right. Nomen ad hoc (talk) 14:01, 25 June 2019 (UTC).

• Is there any benefit of duplicating gazillions of statements to administrative layers (when they match electoral districts)? I think we already have too many person listings on administrative layers and should better find a way to avoid them entirely .. --- Jura 11:24, 25 June 2019 (UTC)

  Jura1, Pasleim, Yair rand, Oravrattas Currently, I am creating an infobox in ukwiki about electoral districts. There, it should be very handy just to take a value of proposed property for a field "current representative". --Tohaomg (talk) 13:11, 25 June 2019 (UTC)

  • Well, we should probably give it some thought how to improve the overall situation. Recent somewhat odd growth lead to many issues, content-wise and structure-wise, and a we should avoid adding more to that. Currently I can only offer you the inclusion of a listeria list or a sparql chart as alternatives. --- Jura 14:59, 25 June 2019 (UTC)

•  Oppose unnecessary inverse property. Better comment on Wikidata:Property proposal/inverse label such that inverse properties can be displayed automatically. --Pasleim (talk) 11:33, 25 June 2019 (UTC)
•  Oppose per Yair rand --Oravrattas (talk) 11:34, 25 June 2019 (UTC)
•  Oppose the representation for electoral districts is subject to regular change and there is variation in exactly how representation works across legislatures. The every politician project has spent time trying to come up with standard and consistent ways of representing this, including the ability to represent past and current representation. I think the existing approaches described at Wikidata:WikiProject every politician/Political data model should be sufficient --Owenpatel (talk) 15:41, 25 June 2019 (UTC)
• @Pasleim, Yair rand, Oravrattas, Owenpatel: In the absence of a property such as this on a constituency item, how would one obtain the most recent representative for a given constituency on that constituency's Wikipedia page (or on any other page which uses the constituency's Wikidata item)? It seems to be near impossible to do so with the current Wikibase Lua API and in the absence of progress on phab:T199887 and phab:T185313. Mahir256 (talk) 22:37, 29 June 2019 (UTC)
  • See my comment above. --- Jura 11:37, 1 July 2019 (UTC)

---

• Yair rand, Pasleim, Oravrattas, Owenpatel, let me summarize it. You deprived ME of a way to improve items about Ukrainian electoral districts, because YOU failed to determine how such a property should look like in your opinion, and gave me no adequate alternative options how can I do it (apart from absurdly difficult options of listeria or sparql chart).--Tohaomg (talk) 14:54, 1 July 2019 (UTC)

  Redundant formats reduce data quality. We lose both accuracy and comprehensiveness when we split efforts across multiple properties. It is not worth it to lower the quality just to make infoboxes easier for the likely (relatively) brief period of time until development work catches up. --Yair rand (talk) 22:32, 1 July 2019 (UTC)

•  Oppose as a redundant inverse of an existing property. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 20:28, 22 September 2019 (UTC)
•  Oppose per above. --Catherine Laurence ^discussion 11:11, 10 November 2019 (UTC)
•  Not done lack of consensus in favor of creating the property --DannyS712 (talk) 19:09, 6 January 2020 (UTC)