Talk:Q1402057

NRC Handelsblad (Q124413382) and NRC Handelsblad (Q1402057)

Hi, can you explain why NRC Handelsblad (Q124413382) and NRC Handelsblad (Q1402057) would be different from each other? Can you provide a source for that statement and solid arguments why they need to be separate? The newspaper vs the organization can be a subtle distinction, yes, but it's important to consider that Wikidata's storage space is limited and that we need to be pragmatic re: the usefulness and maintainability of different items. Spinster 💬 07:20, 2 March 2024 (UTC)

@Spinster: Do you have any evidence that storage space is a limitation, and if so, that one would not start with removing statements that duplicate others, or decide to not host certain content, but instead would allow false statements? CV213 (talk) 15:40, 2 March 2024 (UTC)

And if it's about the organisation, is Mediahuis NRC (Q2664895) any different from NRC Handelsblad (Q124413382)? Is there a need for this new item, because I don't see why it should. Pennenetui3000 (talk) 16:24, 2 March 2024 (UTC)

Please no rhetorical questions. And yes, if things are different then in Wikidata they are normally not merged into on item. That is the purpose of a graph database : each node represents one real-world entity. So, yes, there is a "need". The need is the result of not wanting to store false claims. It is part of the wider Wikimedia mission. CV213 (talk) 21:45, 3 March 2024 (UTC)

@CV213: To respond to your whataboutism: here you can read all the recent updates about the challenges the Wikimedia movement is facing with regard to scaling Wikidata and its query services. You seem to come from a library/data background, just like me, and your contribution to help solve this issue is very welcome. Besides the technical scalability issues, there is also the issue of scale of the community and the amount of work volunteers can take on here with regards maintenance of increasing numbers of items. Spinster 💬 09:50, 3 March 2024 (UTC)

To return to my original question which you have not answered: you have now also removed VIAF ID (P214) from the original NRC Handelsblad (Q1402057) item and moved it to your new item NRC Handelsblad (Q124413382). Why? Being consequent, if we separate items in this case (a major Dutch newspaper, I am a subscriber), Wikidata should also separate out items for all other 350,000+ periodicals described here. Pinging

John Vandenberg Aubrey Daniel Mietchen DarTar Maximilianklein Mvolz Andy Mabbett Mattsenate TomT0m JakobVoss Mahdimoqri Jsamwrites Dig.log Sic19 Andreasmperu Pete F 99of9 Mfchris84 Runner1928 Jneubert Juandev VIGNERON Uomovariabile SilentSpike Ecritures Tfrancart Dick Bos Rdmpage Clifford Anderson Parobis1 Susanna Giaccai Zblace Alessandra.Moi ArthurPSmith Alessandra Boccone Erfurth Mgrenci EthanRobertLee Sandbergja Aliyu shaba Walter Klosse Tommasopaiano Dr. Gogami TiagoLubiana (talk) 21:35, 30 December 2021 (UTC) Metacladistics Maxime Skim Reboot01 Strakhov Barrett Golding (Iffy.news)

Notified participants of WikiProject Periodicals to hear their opinion on this matter and whether they agree this is the way to go. Spinster 💬 09:50, 3 March 2024 (UTC)

@Spinster:

1. To respond to your whataboutism - what do you refer to?
2. To return to my original question which you have not answered - which one would that be? Your initial comment contained two phrases ending with "?".
3. you have now also removed VIAF ID (P214) from the original NRC Handelsblad (Q1402057) item and moved it to your new item NRC Handelsblad (Q124413382). Why? - it is not my item. In Wikidata items are not owned by anyone. Maybe this is the source of your confusion?

You didn't yet provide any evidence as asked for in my first reply, for "that one would not start with removing statements that duplicate others, or decide to not host certain content, but instead would allow false statements?" Instead of pinging just one of the related sectorial Wikiprojects it might be more helpful to at least ping the others two, or even better to get Wikidata:WikiProject Ontology involved. CV213 (talk) 15:20, 3 March 2024 (UTC)

Wikidata:Project_chat#Allow_false_claims_due_to_storage_space_limitations_and_a_claimed_need_to_be_pragmatic. Multichill (talk) 17:36, 3 March 2024 (UTC)

Wikidata_talk:WikiProject_Ontology#Allow_false_claims_due_to_storage_space_limitations_and_a_claimed_need_to_be_pragmatic. CV213 (talk) 21:28, 3 March 2024 (UTC)

While the discussion was ongoing, a pro-conflation user merged the items [1] claiming "as the creator of the new item has not responded to questions why the duplicate item was created, and no clarity or reference has been provided why the second item is needed". That's weird, since it was the merge-person, that didn't respond to questions after they made their first comment on the issue. CV213 (talk) 21:41, 3 March 2024 (UTC)

Tired of wasting time. Block evasion: sock puppet of User:Tobias Conradi. Blocked CV213 like the previous sock (Ac2wd). Multichill (talk) 18:56, 4 March 2024 (UTC)